Supermotos? who gets it and who doesn't.

[squirrelciv]

I've got to say I just don't get supermotos. Never ridden one, but never wanted to either. I must admit I admire any special thats well built and that includes supermotos, but I just don't get why :? All you seem to get to me is the worst of all worlds. The reason I own a dommie is because it allows me to go anywhere. It commutes, tours, and green lanes, a bit of a jack of all trades. If I moto'd it I think I'd lose its rugged ability to cope whatever. I get road tyres, twitchy steering, and lots of shiny stuff to worry about. Might as well of bought a GSX-R and personallised it with carbon bits.

Like I say, this could just be me and my ignorance, so if there are any great lovers of them here please educate me :D

Oh, and I do understand the desire for an individual bike, and better, faster steering, thats why I'm building a cafe racer. The thing that I don't get is why try to get this from a dual sport bike.

I commend the topic to the house. Let the debate begin :D

[Jaffa-cake]

they just look cool :D

[squirrelciv]

To some maybe, I just think they're impractical. Can't get passed the fact that they seem to typify form over function. Like I say, could well be me, but I can't like something that's only saving grace is it's looks. Things have to DO something well, or I can't see the point in them. If I want something pretty, I'll buy a picture. Now if something useful is also beautiful, then great :D

The Wife won't like that, but then again, she can iron :D

[Confucious]

Can say I understand the theory behind the design, but could be a useful eye catching induction tool aimed at youngsters.
http://www.1000ps.at/magazin_motorradkatalog.asp?marke_id=62&bike_id=553
I have to admit, if I was in the market for a moped, looks would be a key factor.

Squirrel - Do supermoto's have "distributors" :lol: ?

[anton88]

If you've ever seen super moto racing you'll understand. Personally I don't think they are very practical for the road, but defininatly good fun.

They are a very cheap way of getting into racing if thats your thing.

[Scott]

To quote jaffa-cake:
they just look cool

Here's the evidence for the defence :D

http://www.xrv.org.uk/getimage.php?id=1836

In BIKE magazine recently this subject was covered, when they carried out a review of three super moto's.

The bike's have arisen from racing, SuperMotard is ios a french term, but I'll be fecked if I can remember all the details from the article....I'll post it all up to bore you later tonight when I get home :)

[Carport]

I don't think they are very practical for the road,

hmm....for a daily cross city commute or hooning around the B roads I can't think of anything else I'd rather be on, good (useable) power combined with excellent visibility and as flickable as a light switch. Not to mention low running costs.

Much more practical than a zxcbgsxr.

Not much cop on a Motorway or Dual carriageway though.(but then neither is zxcbgsxr unless you're doing about 140)

Depends what you want to use it for really.

[squirrelciv]

Carport wrotehmm....for a daily cross city commute or hooning around the B roads I can't think of anything else I'd rather be on, good (useable) power combined with excellent visibility and as flickable as a light switch. Not to mention low running costs.


You just described my standard Dommie :D and she can greenlane. So I ask again, why spend money tarting it up and fitting a smaller front wheel :?

[stoo]

I've got to say I just don't get supermotos. Never ridden one, but never wanted to either. I must admit I admire any special thats well built and that includes supermotos, but I just don't get why :? All you seem to get to me is the worst of all worlds. The reason I own a dommie is because it allows me to go anywhere. It commutes, tours, and green lanes, a bit of a jack of all trades. If I moto'd it I think I'd lose its rugged ability to cope whatever. I get road tyres, twitchy steering, and lots of shiny stuff to worry about. Might as well of bought a GSX-R and personallised it with carbon bits.


http://www.xrv.org.uk/getimage.php?id=1838
http://www.xrv.org.uk/getimage.php?id=1839
http://www.xrv.org.uk/getimage.php?id=1840
http://www.xrv.org.uk/getimage.php?id=1841
http://www.xrv.org.uk/getimage.php?id=1843

Errrrm who says you can't offroad on supermotos exactly? :lol:

OK - it's not as good as it was with the knobblies, obviously - but there's very little proper gnarly off-road down this way anyway - short of going to an MX track.


There are plenty of supermotos which are tarted up to the max with all sorts of bling, and would never see any off road action in a million years for fear of scratching their anodised billet doodads and carbon fibre wotsits, but they ain't all like that!

[Rubberchicken]

There are plenty of supermotos which are tarted up to the max with all sorts of bling, and would never see any off road action in a million years for fear of scratching their anodised billet doodads and carbon fibre wotsits, but they ain't all like that!
Which is kind of silly, since an official supermoto track has an offroad section that is at minimum some (can't be bothered to check) percentage of the track. :-)

[stoo]

There are plenty of supermotos which are tarted up to the max with all sorts of bling, and would never see any off road action in a million years for fear of scratching their anodised billet doodads and carbon fibre wotsits, but they ain't all like that!
Which is kind of silly, since an official supermoto track has an offroad section that is at minimum some (can't be bothered to check) percentage of the track. :-)

Yeah, but there's plenty of dual sport bikes that never see off road either - people buy them for other reasons too - whether it's ergonomics or visibility, or whether they just like the look.

Same with SMs - people buy them for lots of different reasons. Often it's because people want something that'll handle like a sportsbike, with similar acceleration at lower speeds - but a lower top speed, to protect their license.

Some people buy them cos they want the lightest bike possible for stunting on, without getting something as impractical as a trials bike.

I bought mine originally because I wanted a road bike, but with longer travel suspension - at the time I had to ride down a flight of steps to get the bike into my back garden, which was no fun on my old VF500F :lol:

There are also a few tarmac-only SM race series. In the UK there are so few proper supermoto tracks, so they often end up on the more tight and twisty road race circuits, and go-kart tracks too.

[Jaffa-cake]

I personally like the home built supermotos made up from off road bikes like CR's and XR's a lot better than the factory made SM's.

[Rubberchicken]

Yeah, but there's plenty of dual sport bikes that never see off road either - people buy them for other reasons too - whether it's ergonomics or visibility, or whether they just like the look.
True, true... Recently saw a BMW HP2 on road tyres... :roll:

Same with SMs - people buy them for lots of different reasons. Often it's because people want something that'll handle like a sportsbike, with similar acceleration at lower speeds - but a lower top speed, to protect their license.
That I can understand. I know I should not buy a 600cc fourbanger, no way, no how. Tried a mate's R6 once. That's a life-shortening piece of kit, that. Goes like stink, though. :D

I bought my NX as a starter bike (dad's old cb500four didn't really cut it) and the allroad thing is nice because I'm a tall guy...

Still wondering what to buy next though, this one's getting on a bit at 48000 miles. Something a bit more mileage-proof, thinking about AT or TA, or a bmw-gs of some kind if I can get the thing 'round the back and into the shed... (Airhead boxer width: 80 cm. Doorframe width: 80 cm. Errrr.)

[stoo]

True, true... Recently saw a BMW HP2 on road tyres... :roll:

Like this one (http://www.visordown.com/forums/showthread.php?t=252445)? (The pic may not work unless you're a member of visordown - I'd shrink it and post it here, but can't until I get to my PC at home.)

In some ways I don't get that thing at all - too heavy to be a good off-roader, too gutless to be a fun road bike, too basic to be a good tourer, too expensive to be a toy (for the likes of me anyway :cry: )

Would love a go on one though - I bet it'd be surprisingly fun to ride.


That I can understand. I know I should not buy a 600cc fourbanger, no way, no how. Tried a mate's R6 once. That's a life-shortening piece of kit, that. Goes like stink, though. :D

I bought my NX as a starter bike (dad's old cb500four didn't really cut it) and the allroad thing is nice because I'm a tall guy...

Still wondering what to buy next though, this one's getting on a bit at 48000 miles. Something a bit more mileage-proof, thinking about AT or TA, or a bmw-gs of some kind if I can get the thing 'round the back and into the shed... (Airhead boxer width: 80 cm. Doorframe width: 80 cm. Errrr.)

Eek. Sounds like a tight squeeze. :lol:


I personally like the home built supermotos made up from off road bikes like CR's and XR's a lot better than the factory made SM's.

The japanese factories haven't really made a decent effort yet on the factory SM front, but the European factories are coming out with some blinders. The KTM 525SMR, Husaberg 650, Husqvarna 570RR (and the droolworthy Nox) are all factory made SMs but more like a proper race SM than the Honda FMX650, Yam XT660X, Suzuki DZ400SM type things are...

[Scott]

Like I said I'd post up the proper info from BIKE magazine on the history of Supermotard's:

It all started as a crrrazy idea in USA, with Superbikers TV show.
Superbikers came about from Superstars (remember on BBC; it was sold to BBC from US TV)....well apparently there was a Motorcycle Olympiad with riders competing on all sorts of events on the one bike e.g. drag, motocross, trials, dirt track and road races...this led to the Superbikers idea.
US TV network ABC expanded Superstars to Superbikers.
Superbikers made top riders of the day and up and coming riders race one machine on half dirt, half tarmac tracks. Bikes were 500cc 2 stroke or 750cc 4 stroke, mostly crossers with lowered supension and big front brakes all running dirt-track tyres.
Superbikers stopped in the 80's, however in France the idea was just taking off and made it into a TV series - Motard is French for bikers hence SuperMotard :)
The whole thing grew and deveolped into a Championship series attracting big names once more.
The idealogoy of the Supermoto is "Hopped-up crossers with fat road wheels with proper brakes".

So there you go. :thumbup:

[Rubberchicken]

(BMW HP2)
In some ways I don't get that thing at all - too heavy to be a good off-roader, too gutless to be a fun road bike, too basic to be a good tourer, too expensive to be a toy (for the likes of me anyway :cry: )
Yeah, way too expensive, and then some...

But gutless? Nah.

And too heavy? Oh I dunno, they seem to be enjoying themselves here: ;-)
http://dentistavolante.smugmug.com/gallery/1049679/1/48737411/Large
http://dentistavolante.smugmug.com/gallery/1049679/2/48737441/Large
http://dentistavolante.smugmug.com/gallery/1215611/2/56865031/Large
http://dentistavolante.smugmug.com/gallery/1063781/1/49417923/Large
http://dentistavolante.smugmug.com/gallery/1063781/4/49417977/Large

Though I admit it takes a special kind of nutter to ride one like that. ;-)

Would love a go on one though - I bet it'd be surprisingly fun to ride.
Yesplease. :-)

[stoo]

Hehehe - that reminds me of a pic I saw of Kenny Roberts Snr. riding a V-Max very sideways off road. :shock: :lol:


Not saying it can't be done, but for us mere mortals, riding a heavy bike off-road is asking for punishment. The extra weight makes it that much more likely that you'll drop it over any technical sections, and then you've got to pick up all that extra weight every time....

For gentle trail use it would obviously be fine - but then so would the AT, TA, Dommy, GS Adventure or any other big trailie - and they'd all be considerably more versatile with it.

[Rubberchicken]

Hehehe - that reminds me of a pic I saw of Kenny Roberts Snr. riding a V-Max very sideways off road. :shock: :lol:
Not a v-max, but...
http://www.magnabagger.com/NL/projectgifs/1_1361_1020859877.jpg

Not saying it can't be done, but for us mere mortals, riding a heavy bike off-road is asking for punishment. The extra weight makes it that much more likely that you'll drop it over any technical sections, and then you've got to pick up all that extra weight every time....
Apparently you get used to it, and don't forget those boxers have a low center of gravity...

And I can tell you, there's nothing like seeing a 700cc V4 with carbon cans howl across some deep sand tracks on TKC80s... It's a truly awesome sight. :-D

For gentle trail use it would obviously be fine - but then so would the AT, TA, Dommy, GS Adventure or any other big trailie - and they'd all be considerably more versatile with it.
Well yeah, on gentle trails you can get away with just about any bike...

And then there's the guys who are completely utterly mindblowingly bonkers, taking a K100RT on road tyres across a muddy path that I would have to think twice about on my dommie with knobbies.

http://onderhoud.luiemotorfiets.net/NL/fotoboekgifs/4266_2802_1024857055.jpg

[stoo]

And I can tell you, there's nothing like seeing a 700cc V4 with carbon cans howl across some deep sand tracks on TKC80s... It's a truly awesome sight. :-D


You should come over and go trail riding with my mate Keith then...

http://www.solentsupermotos.co.uk/cpg143/albums/userpics/Picture_800.JPG


:lol:

[Rubberchicken]

You should come over and go trail riding with my mate Keith then...
Like it! :-D

[stoo]

You should come over and go trail riding with my mate Keith then...
Like it! :-D

It's quite....... interesting.... to ride. :shock: :lol:

[squirrelciv]

Well that seems to have been a hearty debate, but no ones convinced me a SM is any better than my standard Dommie, and now I know the French are involved, that killed it dead for me :D (we had 'em on the run till that pesky Joan woman turned up :evil: )

I will admit though that this is probably a personal thing. I never did get the point of anything that isn't totally functional, with the exeption of really good food and drink.

[scudmotodude]

I have had various road bikes, A GS500E, A CBR6FY, Hornet 600 with the fairing, a truimph speed triple thats tuned, and then I had the XR600R supermoto, which opened my eyes to the handing ability of these things, I know ya lose tank range, ya lose comfort for long distances, but what you gain is the ability to take the piss out of sports bike riders over bumpy, tight and twisty roads. The FMX, even tho its standard, still kicks the butt of sportsbikes over my local twisties..........

Its all about fun :)

[samben]

I had an FMX and it was great fun around the lakes last year. When it comes to the twistys they have no equal. I ride with a friend with a GSX-R and untill we get to the straights he can,t keep up.

[Mr NiceGuy]

Supermoto's are just way too much fun on the twisties and around town. Much more fun than a Domi in these areas, unfortunately outside those areas they are limited. My commute on my Supermoto was just a scream but the wife wouldn't go on the back of it and it was hard work on boring long straight roads.

YES! I would have another as a toy if I could afford to run two bikes.

[Warthog]

The thing that I don't get is why try to get this from a dual sport bike.




Personlly,I do get them and I love them! Firstly, in response to you comment above, strictly speaking a Smoto is not done with a dual sport (by which I uynderstand biger trailies, ATs, XTZs, etc). Supermotos were origianlly a racing class run half on a tarmac track and half on the dirt. They were exactly that: a dirt bike (enduro motocross, single cylinder) with 17 inch rims for grippier tyres.

And herein is the beauty! Where do you use them? Towns, tracks, B-roads etc: they rock. I had a Dommie on standard wheels. It handled. I put 17inch 120/150BT 090s and it handled a lot better. I leaned that bike stupidly: more so that on dualsport tyres. Then theres the agility of a very light bike (ok not the Dommie, but a real SM-able bike, such as the DRZ, XR, or some crazy Maico 500 2-stroke!) matched to these very grippy tyres. I had no problems keeping up with psorts bikes in the twisties, and left most behind in the city. Potholes? Not a problem either!

I see SMs actually as bringing the best of sports bikes with the best of dirt bikes. In a climate where insurance is getting ridiculous, Big Brother is photographing you at every opportunity, and the roads look like they've been shelled, enduro style bikes are perect: bred for fun and agility without having to go warp speed, and with even better tyres, they flourish, IMO.

Not everyones cup of tea, fine, but I have another now (my XR,), and I love it.

To any sceptics, I say try one and then decide: you may be surprised!!:thumbup:

[Warthog]

HP2: In some ways I don't get that thing at all - too heavy to be a good off-roader, too gutless to be a fun road bike, too basic to be a good tourer, too expensive to be a toy (for the likes of me anyway :cry: )



Sorry, but "gutless"?!? Man, you is craaaazy!!:blob8:

105 hp & 85 ft/lb torque in 175Kg!!

What do you want in a bike? A turbo-charged turbo charger?

That is loads more torque, only slightly less power and several kg less than my old TL1000S and there is no way that was described as gutless: it was the benchmark v-twin, engine-wise at the time of its launch and for some time afterward....

The HP2 is absolutely arm-wrenching

[Warthog]

and now I know the French are involved, that killed it dead for me :iconbiggrin:...... I never did get the point of anything that isn't totally functional,


How can a modification that improves the speed of steering, and allows you far more grip than you would have otherwise be anything other than functional?

One might be very capable on a pair of tourances or distanzias, but by their nature sports compound tyres, in a given situation (on tarmac) will always have more grip on tap, than a dual sport tyres, otherwise all the 4 cylinder sport bikes would leave the factory on BT trailwings....

I can see that some may not like them, or feel that their bike, as standard, does everything they need it to, and hence any further changes would be only of cosmetic worth. However, I feel one cannot say that a Super Moto conversion, when used on the road, only has aesthetic purposes inherent to its design..... On the contrary, it is an entirely functional design that happens to look ludicrously cool!!!!:toothy1:


Oh and I'm half French!! I urinate in you're general direction!!!! ;)

[Rubberchicken]

Depends on what you want from a bike.

If it's a hoon bike then the 17 inches will make it even more of an urban assault vehicle. ;-)

But if it's a workhorse that gets you around (and I believe that it is for the squirrel, how's the fun bike coming along anyway?) then you don't really gain much, and it's a significant pile of money, wheels like that.

[trevor morgan]

10 minutes on my YZ will bring the hooligan out in anyone!
http://www.xrv.org.uk/photopost/data/500/DSCF00391.JPG

[Rubberchicken]

I once was offered a test ride on a Husky 450 SM in race trim...

I declined. Because otherwise I'm positive that either I'd want one, or I'd end up in the scenery somewhere.

That thing was MAD.

[Cabby]

- at the time I had to ride down a flight of steps to get the bike into my back garden, which was no fun on my old VF500F :lol:



Now.... I get that....perfectly.......:D

[Oldie]

Hi check this out!
http://supermoto-umbauten.de/105/Presseumbauten/Dominator.html
Im sure you can translate the page on the web..
also:
http://supermoto-umbauten.de/107/Sportschalldämpfer/Akrapovic.html
http://supermoto-umbauten.de/111/Sportschalldämpfer/Sebring.html
http://supermoto-umbauten.de/138/Sportschalldämpfer/Leo_Vince.html
http://supermoto-umbauten.de/532/Sportschalldämpfer/Arrow.html
http://supermoto-umbauten.de/109/Krümmer.html
enjoy..
Ciaoo Oldie

[sbikerbud]

thinking of p/ex'ing the FMX for one of these

http://www.motorcycledaily.com/100807middle.jpg

KTM690 smc

although i might be tempted by this instead
http://www.ktmecuador.com/2008/Onroad/duke690.jpg
KTM690 Duke

Have to see what the great flexible god of plastic will allow;)

[Mudwiz]

I've put "road" tyres, for me anyway, on my XR, and it's such a blast on the roads!
I can't go SM wheels (£££!), but even on Trailwings its a real hoot on the worst of roads. When I kill these tyres I'm definately going for some "road only" tyres - Metzler Lasertecs seem to be the best in the sizes I need.

Now, I get it!

:grin:.

[AIRWOLF]

If you have a ride on one, you will 'get it' :cool::D:D:D

[Snaphappy]

Who can say who are the best riders, road race or MX, this question was raised many years ago, to find an answer they put out a challenge half road half dirt super-motard was born if you haven't been to a race then go. This must be one of the cheapest forms of racing out there.
Very fast very exiting well worth a day out, yes your dommie can green lane but get a second set of wheels with more road grip and double your fun

go and watch super-moto if you dont enjoy it I'll refund your ticket cost

[Oldie]

If you are in Spain you can see the Spanish Championship for SuperMotos this weekend 5-8 April on Circuito de Campillos, Crta Jerez-Cartagena km101, Campillos Malaga. Its also the Aprilia Cup.

[russh]

I took a DRz 400-SM on test from a dealers a while ago, I didn't realise you could have so much fun with 40 bhp.

I wouldn't dare buy one though, they encourage you to ride like a loon:D

OK it was dry, but how much grip from full on road tyres? And the way it just flung it's self into corners thanks to the reduced gyroscopic effect of a 17" front wheel and with the leverage from the wide bars. There seemed to be only one way to ride...like a hooligan! Not conducive with reaching pensioner status.

[Palmer]

I took a DRz 400-SM on test from a dealers a while ago, I didn't realise you could have so much fun with 40 bhp.

I wouldn't dare buy one though, they encourage you to ride like a loon:D

OK it was dry, but how much grip from full on road tyres? And the way it just flung it's self into corners thanks to the reduced gyroscopic effect of a 17" front wheel and with the leverage from the wide bars. There seemed to be only one way to ride...like a hooligan! Not conducive with reaching pensioner status.



I hate supermotards, i meen who would want to ever ride a bike that you can have so much fun out of little power compared to most bikes, the handling isn't bad either :toothy3::grin::grin::grin:

[Chad]

I hate supermotards, i meen who would want to ever ride a bike that you can have so much fun out of little power compared to most bikes, the handling isn't bad either :toothy3::grin::grin::grin:


THE ktm 990SM covers all the comfort and tank range issues and well as being stark staring bonkers...i dare you to try one and not be impressed:D

[Rubberchicken]

Looks good on pictures though I suppose, got any fanmail yet? ;-)

[russh]

I hate supermotards, i meen who would want to ever ride a bike that you can have so much fun out of little power compared to most bikes, the handling isn't bad either :toothy3::grin::grin::grin:


:D:D:D I agree, just as well Honda don't make one? ;););)

[russh]

THE ktm 990SM covers all the comfort and tank range issues and well as being stark staring bonkers...i dare you to try one and not be impressed:D


I'm sorry, complete loons only for that thing:D

http://fixinbones.smugmug.com/photos/212547832-L.jpg

[davsato]

i converted my XT600E to supermoto, put stiffer front springs in, sticky tyres, loud performance exhaust and decent air filter.
SMs are great fun around town up to say, 60mph, and not much will keep up with one because the handling is superb. no fun at all on dual carriageways and forget motorways, though i have done the odd trip on mine (but its got decent comfort, not like a converted MXer)

[Chad]

I'm sorry, complete loons only for that thing:D

http://fixinbones.smugmug.com/photos/212547832-L.jpgtissue's now please:D

[Palmer]

:D:D:D I agree, just as well Honda don't make one? ;););)


Yes good job that is, otherwise i would have to leave biking for ever :rolleyes::D:D



Seriously though, i think the 950 ktm sm is alot nicer looking, but it has less power, so im thinking whats the 1190 gunna be like :D:D:blob3::blob4::toothy7::toothy7:

[jasonbc]

Bmw Are doing the HP2 Megamoto and it is an absolute animal to ride serious wheels off the ground fun in any gear just about.

Supermoto racing started in france in the late 80's as a cheap fun sport and i can see why, But within saying that i test rode the ktm690 supermoto and was expecting an animal but it was tame. I was expecting competion performance lik ethe off road bikes. The ktm launch guys at fowlers said they had been de-tuned for longer service intervals.

But they've stil got to be more fun and more practical than any fireblade, ninja or R1 could ever be on the B roads

[Palmer]

Bmw Are doing the HP2 Megamoto and it is an absolute animal to ride serious wheels off the ground fun in any gear just about.

Supermoto racing started in france in the late 80's as a cheap fun sport and i can see why, But within saying that i test rode the ktm690 supermoto and was expecting an animal but it was tame. I was expecting competion performance lik ethe off road bikes. The ktm launch guys at fowlers said they had been de-tuned for longer service intervals.

But they've stil got to be more fun and more practical than any fireblade, ninja or R1 could ever be on the B roads


But the HP2 is a BMW and over priced :rolleyes:

[siuk]

i have a fmx 650 also had a fireblade 929 rr sold the blade cos i found myself going out all the time on the fmx just so much fun yes the blade was a really fast bike but always went on the fmx so so so much fun :blob2:

[Oldie]

yeh wish I hade the money.. ;)
anyone who knows where to find cheaper wheels then this: http://www.motostrano.com/wheelstires.html to put on a dommie...
:happy7:

[catteeclan]

I managed to get an old domi front and have it respoked with a new 17" rim. Still cost £250 though. Plus tyre and new bearings.

[Oldie]

What about the brakes? Everyone tells me that the brakes is the problem if you put smaller wheels on. Do you know exactly why? Havent really got the time yet to find out but all sets comes with new brake parts.. and all shops here speak spanish so...:(
Ciao Oldie

[Mr NiceGuy]

You would normally upgrade the front brakes for a stronger caliper and bigger disc.

[catteeclan]

You would normally upgrade the front brakes for a stronger caliper and bigger disc.

No prob with the brakes. All standard on mine. You can get a bigger disc and bracket to space out the oringal caliper. Either ways good.