led indicator question

[Xander]

Hey,
I have a problem with the instillation of some new led indicators. They wired in fine, and work as long as I had 3 in and on filament (incandescent) one in. When I put the 4th on in they no longer work. It is not that they flash too fast they do not flash at all.. I assumed that the flasher relay is just getting way too much voltage, so am considering putting a 150ohms /10 watt resistor but this would have to go in line with each indicator. The only problem with this is they would get VERY hot. So option two would be to change over to an electronic voltage free flasher. Any one used one of these. But of course all this assumes that my initial assumption (that there is just voltage getting back to the flasher).

Am I making any sense?

[Lord Vader]

Maybe
but i would not know anyway
to many big words for me in that post for me

[RuftyTufty]

I can't help with that problem but I bought an LED flasher yesterday and then realised they're no good for bikes. In a car the LED flasher points straight back, as it should. In a bike indicator the LED points to the side, reducing the effectiveness.

A bike needs the old bulb type because of the way the indicator housing is made.

So go back to bulbs.

[Lumiya]

Hey,
I have a problem with the instillation of some new led indicators. They wired in fine, and work as long as I had 3 in and on filament (incandescent) one in. When I put the 4th on in they no longer work. It is not that they flash too fast they do not flash at all.. I assumed that the flasher relay is just getting way too much voltage, so am considering putting a 150ohms /10 watt resistor but this would have to go in line with each indicator. The only problem with this is they would get VERY hot. So option two would be to change over to an electronic voltage free flasher. Any one used one of these. But of course all this assumes that my initial assumption (that there is just voltage getting back to the flasher).

Am I making any sense?

Yeah, you are right in thinking that a resistor woud get hot, especially when you consider that the relays need about 20Watts so about 1.6amps on a 12v circuit to run.

I would only got the way of an electronic timed flasher unit instead of relying on the bulb wattage to complete the Cap/Resitor network.

Kymmy

[Lumiya]

I can't help with that problem but I bought an LED flasher yesterday and then realised they're no good for bikes. In a car the LED flasher points straight back, as it should. In a bike indicator the LED points to the side, reducing the effectiveness.

A bike needs the old bulb type because of the way the indicator housing is made.

So go back to bulbs.

If it's using narrow angle LED's then it's a very poor quality unit. Most decent units use a wide angle led (150 degrees) which is more than enough for any indicator application.

Kymmy

[Xander]

Yeah, you are right in thinking that a resistor woud get hot, especially when you consider that the relays need about 20Watts so about 1.6amps on a 12v circuit to run.

I would only got the way of an electronic timed flasher unit instead of relying on the bulb wattage to complete the Cap/Resitor network.

Kymmy

thanks kymmy, , I went out and got one.. from hein gerkie (or how ever you spell it) for only 10quid!!!... unfortunately it is too wet out there to play with electircal stuff.. but I'll I ll tell you how (if ) it works after the next dry day.

[Dee Duble Yuh]

If it's using narrow angle LED's then it's a very poor quality unit. Most decent units use a wide angle led (150 degrees) which is more than enough for any indicator application.

Kymmy

I don't understand this, sorry. On most bike indicators the bulb faces 90 degrees from the front/rear. Even 150 degrees won't be enough because that's only 75 degrees forwards and 75 degrees backwards. Anyone directly behind would be at 90 degrees so will only see a little of what reflects off part of the reflector.

What problem are you trying to solve, Xander? The overall effect surely won't be brighter than filament bulbs. They should last longer, but is it worth the hassle and expense? If you must fiddle, why not buy proper halogen replacements?

[Lumiya]

I think the angle of viewing is more personal preference than anything. It's not part of the MOT as the MOT book says the following:

The precise position and angle of visibility of direction indicators are not part of this inspection, but they must be on each side of the longitudinal axis of a solo machine.

Also as far as viewing angle most LED indicator clusters I've seen are slightly curved or at least have a couple of LED's angled towards the outside edge.

Kymmy

[Austin]

I don't understand this, sorry. On most bike indicators the bulb faces 90 degrees from the front/rear. Even 150 degrees won't be enough because that's only 75 degrees forwards and 75 degrees backwards. Anyone directly behind would be at 90 degrees so will only see a little of what reflects off part of the reflector.

What problem are you trying to solve, Xander? The overall effect surely won't be brighter than filament bulbs. They should last longer, but is it worth the hassle and expense? If you must fiddle, why not buy proper halogen replacements?

I am assuming that Xander has replaced the whole unit, not just the bulb. In the new unit the bulbs will facing the right direction, ie backwards.

I have experimented with some LEDs to repalce existing bulbs - clocks and stop/tail and find they are just not bright enough. For a replacement you seem to need to replace the full unit and with a cluster of LEDs.

[Xander]

What problem are you trying to solve, Xander? The overall effect surely won't be brighter than filament bulbs. They should last longer, but is it worth the hassle and expense? If you must fiddle, why not buy proper halogen replacements?

I like LEDs because yes they are brighter (maybe not in actual lumes, but to my eye).. They also allow a smaller unit (less likely to get snapped) which i just like.. but the most important thing to me is that if you buy a good unit.. they are sealed.. I.e you can go under water and will not have any leaks .. which means they will not blow on you in the most inappropriate time, reason 2 on the continent you have to carry spair bulbs for everything the lights up.. LED are exempt from this cus they do not blow.. this means less sh1t in your tool kit = less weigt = more fun..

as for the angle thing..Kymmy is 100% correct.. but in less technical terms. LED only project forward (this focused beam) which means the reflector is useless, if there is no leds pointing in the reflector direction.. my new signals even have a led point to the side and front.. so i have lights at the back and side.. they are really good.. although maybe a little too small.. we shall see..

I am assuming that Xander has replaced the whole unit, not just the bulb. In the new unit the bulbs will facing the right direction, ie backwards.

I am not worred about angle stuff, just lack of flash rate. Mu complete unit the leds are facing in many directions... I have not just replaces the bulb.. but the entire signal.. with a sealed water proof one..