ABS - do you agree with it?

[StumpyFingers]

No matter how well you ride, there will come a time when you grab just a bit too hard and lock the brakes.
ABS will stop this and let you keep control.
So I agree that your instructor is a Moron.

[Rubberchicken]

I do agree with that, and I would like to have ABS for that, as I've been there, done that... But.

Essentially, an ABS system is there to not do what you tell it to: BRAKE, this hard, NOW! I'd like it to do that as little as possible, as it won't always be right.

ABS that stops me locking the front and hitting the deck? Good.

ABS that lets me do a stoppie on a dirt road? Excellent!

ABS that lets the front go because of stuff happening to the rear? Not on my bike... (So that's BMW out )

[Boris]

ABS that lets the front go because of stuff happening to the rear? Not on my bike... (So that's BMW out )

I suspect they all must do that to some extent as I have been unable to do a stoppie on the vara despite pulling the front anchor on hard. I'm pretty sure there is enough grip to do it (maybe someone without ABS on a vara can confirm) but assuming there is then the only way to stop one is for the abs to release the front brake a little.

Unless of course someone knows different.

[sean]

I dont have ABS and chose not to have ABS. Its complicated and not needed. as a safety featurs its marginal better to pay the money and learn to brake like a pro. as the bike gets older and gremlins set in ABS is just something else to go wrong. Adding "safety features" to things just allows people not to think for themselves. I am a great believer in the risk compensation theory and see it every time at the side of the road in thge first signs of frost where cagers over cook corners because of poor training and an over fed sense that their car can do anything. I believe in two things i know i can trust every time experience and training nough said

+1......

[Warthog]

I dont have ABS and chose not to have ABS. Its complicated and not needed. as a safety featurs its marginal better to pay the money and learn to brake like a pro.

ABS should have nothing to do with "braking like a pro". The two or three times that my ABS has kicked it, it has not been because I was trying to outbrake someone, or riding fast, it is because something unexpected occured.

All the training in the world will not give you "ACME Diesel vision - catch diesel before it catches you!!"

I believe in two things i know i can trust every time experience and training nough said

Training, fair enough, but experience is simply the things we've encountered that haven't killed us...

Sometimes that is down to luck, nothing else.

That is where ABS can help: tipping the scales of luck in your favour so that you do live to learn from that situation, rather than languish in a recovery ward.... or worse.

[Warthog]

I suspect they all must do that to some extent as I have been unable to do a stoppie on the vara despite pulling the front anchor on hard. I'm pretty sure there is enough grip to do it (maybe someone without ABS on a vara can confirm) but assuming there is then the only way to stop one is for the abs to release the front brake a little.

Unless of course someone knows different.

Surely you'd feel it if ABS kicked-in.

Some bikes just don't stoppie well. An 1150GS for example!! It was not because of ABS: the geometry, weight and brakes, simply did not suite it. I'd stoppied most other bikes I'd owned.

[Dee Duble Yuh]

... ABS that lets the front go because of stuff happening to the rear? Not on my bike... (So that's BMW out )

There have been a few references to ABS releasing the front brake if the rear skids. Does anyone know this for a fact? I can't imagine why ABS would be designed that way. Perhaps a loose or wet surface affected both tyres? Or maybe you experienced a general reduction in braking effect and assumed the front had been release when in fact it was only the rear?

Although I'm a supporter of ABS, you have to remember that it doesn't guarantee braking power; it only helps to avoid a skid which is more about maintaining steering. If there's no grip there's no grip and you won't be able to brake.

I read that statistically there's very little difference in accident rates for vehicles with ABS and without ABS. Apparently drivers take more risks because they believe ABS will bail them out. So the moral of the story is, buy a bike with ABS but ride like it's not there.

[Warthog]

There have been a few references to ABS releasing the front brake if the rear skids. Does anyone know this for a fact? I can't imagine why ABS would be designed that way.

Presumably so that the front of the bike will pull the rear back into line..... and avoid a low-side: a guess.

So the moral of the story is, buy a bike with ABS but ride like it's not there.

Definitely agree. There is a difference between using features as a back-up, and relying on them to ride the bike for you.

That is one aspect why I feel all these proximity radars and warnings on cars are a double edged sword: drivers may think less....

[Boris]

There have been a few references to ABS releasing the front brake if the rear skids. Does anyone know this for a fact? I can't imagine why ABS would be designed that way. Perhaps a loose or wet surface affected both tyres? Or maybe you experienced a general reduction in braking effect and assumed the front had been release when in fact it was only the rear?

From BMW ABS and ASC - webBikeWorld

While conventional two-channel ABS brake systems are only able to evaluate wheel speed signals, BMW Motorrad’s integral system provides more information, monitoring both pressure signals in the two brake circuits and the speed of both wheels and thus determining the degree of stopping power and, accordingly, any tendency of the rear wheel to lift off.

The system is therefore able to effectively counteract such behavior in good time by specifically reducing brake pressure on the front wheel in the interest of enhanced riding stability and maximum stopping power.

[Boris]

Surely you'd feel it if ABS kicked-in.

Not on the Honda ABS system on the Vara. Unlike the older setup there is no pulsing at the levers.